Från:                                PowerfulChoices@gmail.com

Skickat:                           Wednesday, February 15, 2012 01:57 AM

Till:                                  'Taylor, Bernard (LLU)'

Ämne:                             Thanks Bernard! RE: George Phrantza Texts

 

 

יהוה אלהים

Tree of Life ©

Non-negotiable. Private between the parties.

 

   

 

 

 

Sweden Republic ©

[Outside the State of Sweden]

 

 

 

Written with a beginning on 5924_[((*??*))] 10^[1] 16 2028

 

The Fifth Day [of the week,]

 

the 16^th day of month #10, 16 Tevet,

in the 5924^th_[(??)] year following the beginning recorded in Genesis 1

and in the 2028^th year following the beginning recorded in Luke 1:26-33

 

[The 13^th  day of the month per ancient Rabbinical reckoning,

16 Shevat (month #11) per more recent Jewish reckoning

(based upon a decimal error in Hillel II’s directives causing a wandering of the seasons!),

 

[Thursday, the 4^th day of the Pope’s week (as revised in Sweden from 1973 A.D.,)

February 9 in the 2011^th year of Caesar Tiberius

(per current Gregorian reckoning in Europe and elsewhere,)

Cf. Daniel 7:25…]

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Bernard,

 

I very much appreciate and value your help with those translations of Georgii Phrantzae’s Annales!

Receiving your mail and seeing that you had fully met my desire by translating both the Greek and the Latin passages I felt my heart warming, and I remain very touched by your generous investment of time and efforts towards accomplishing those, to me, most valuable translations!

I wish to thank you from the very bottom of my heart! Now and forever!

 

I do recognize that your translations represent the best that can likely be accomplished based upon accepted standards of Greek and Latin grammar and linguistics alone. And that is exactly the type of translations that I desired and hoped for. Again thanks!

 

I don’t know to what extent you may be interested in the remainder of this response mail to you? Nevertheless, the remainder of this email is intended only as a way of sharing a little of my own further work towards accomplishing harmony between Georgii Phrantzae’s text and the best current representations of that event as available by means of modern tools such as my astronomy software, NASA’s Phases of the Moon Tables, etc..  

My wish and hope is that you will accept the following as a very small token of my appreciation of your work. Just in case you happen to be interested… And to the extent that you might not already know…

Also, here is a link to that portion of my main astronomy related web page where the links to your translations are being made available to my readers. Please recognize that most every link within my web pages is intended to provide the fundamentals supporting the context of such links. Well, here follows some of my meandering thoughts and work re this particular:

 

 

Comets are small enough heavenly bodies that their paths in space are much more easily perturbed by meteorites and other such space debris than are moons, planets, suns, and stars. In consequence thereof the paths and timing of comets are frequently being changed to the effect that comets are being lost track of by science for many years. It follows that the reconstructions of cometary events of ancient history, even by the very best of modern science, are not always exactly reliable. Unfortunately, this has further ramifications in that certain variables in the mathematical formulas being used for calculating the exact timing of astronomical events of ancient times are themselves less reliable than they otherwise might have been…

Naturally, such uncertainties, which has been much greater in past years, reflect also upon the branches of science dealing with dating ancient events generally, for instance, history and chronology. Thus, you will recognize that the uncertainties within history and within astronomy science will affect one another for better and for worse…

But, unfortunately, it does not stop there. The accepted rules of grammar and linguistics are certainly also based upon, and dependent upon, the reliability of our best available understanding of events within ancient history. No doubt you are well aware of the accepted rules of Greek grammar re such things as pertain to duration of time vs. point in time. Well, those rules have been relied upon by translators for centuries, no doubt. And those translators and their translations have been, in turn, relied upon by historians and astronomers alike. So you see, it is only too easy to get caught in circular reasoning where one faction of science blindly relies upon another who blindly relies upon the first…

Well, as you can see from the above, I have no absolutely reliable representation of Georgii Phrantzae’s comet to fall back upon. As always, the reality of that one event was what it was - whatever it was - and it remains for me and others to work our ways towards an ever better and more correct understanding of it until all the pieces of the puzzle fit nicely together.

Among the specifics that I am wrestling with presently are the following reliable facts:

1) I have been able to clearly identify, using Georgii Phrantzae’s complete work Annales alone, that the Byzantine year 6962 corresponds to the year beginning with that day which in the Julian calendar is known as September 1, 1453 CE. More specifically, on lines 2 and 3 of page 36 of Annales I find a double date of Georgii Phrantzae that identifies (the greater portion  of) 1328 CE with 6836 Byzantine time. Cf. my Excel file at this link…  (Should you feel moved to translate for me that one Greek sentence ending at the top of page 36, that too would be of great value to me…)

2) Within the year beginning September 1, 1453 CE, there are only two lunar eclipses, both of them total, one on November 16, 1453 at 14:20 [2:20 PM] Istanbul local time, and one on May 12, 1454 at 08:53 [AM] Istanbul local time.

3) Neither comets, nor lunar eclipses, are easily observed, if at all, in daytime such as were both of the above said total eclipse events of 1453, as potentially observable from the Byzantine horizon. [Which fact seem to stand in the way of translating Georgii Phrantzae’s text in terms of a lunar eclipse and in terms of a full moon. Could it be that the corresponding Greek word(s) were intended rather to convey the fact that the moon was “mature” or past the astronomical full moon? I would tend towards a translation more in terms of “and, having approached (to) the aging moon…”]

4) Earthquakes are events that are very limited in time and which are never reasonably described as recurring on a daily basis at the same time of day for 18 days in a row such as is being suggested by a translation of Georgii Phrantzae’s text based upon the accepted standards of Greek grammar. No doubt you, being a Californian yourself (and thus used to earth quakes,) have also reflected upon that fact while translating Georgii Phrantzae’s text? [My working hypothesis presently is that said “18 days” should be more accurately translated in terms of September 18, 1453… That is, in spite of generally accepted Greek grammar… (I notice that the astronomical full moon occurred on September 18, 1453 at 3:18 AM Istanbul local time…)]

5) From my many years of research into these things, I’ve discovered that, so far as concerns the ancient use of the Greek language, said Greek grammatical rule re duration vs. point in time is an error which holds no truth…

6) September 25, 1453, is not necessarily a date that could not be accurately translated as an event “In the summer of…” and thus, my conclusions thus far, as reflected at this link, may still be viable…

Indeed, if you compare with me the meaning of the following Greek and Hebrew words using Strong’s Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries: H6972, H7019, G2325, G2326, G2330, you might find, as I did, that the Greek word used by Phrantzae corresponds to said Greek words in Strong’s. Furthermore, I once did an extensive word study of the corresponding Hebrew word, and, lo and behold, it became obvious to me that those Hebrew words as used quite frequently in the Bible are consistently mistranslated as “the end,” whereas the true meaning is “the point of beginning.” Accordingly, I find that the proper translation of Phrantzae’s Greek words should be, not “In the summer of 6962…,” but “In the beginning of 6962…”

7) Re the words translated ‘west’ and ‘east’ etc.: I find that – per my astronomy software Starry Night Backyard - Halley’s comet, as observable shortly after sunset, did not pass zenith towards the western portion of the sky until November 19, 1453 CE. From that position it moved in a westerly direction evening by evening until it disappeared behind the western horizon no later than January 13, 1454 CE. After that, in the evenings, Halley’s comet was not again located in the western skies until around May 22, 1454 CE, but at that time it was already quite far away on its route away from the Sun and had likely lost most of its brightness and disappeared out of sight. By July 7, 1454 CE it again disappeared behind the western horizon.

[Accordingly, I find a problem with the translations:

“a comet… began to appear out of the western parts of the horizon from the beginning of each evening, immediately after the setting of the sun”

and

“seeing the… comet, and its moving from the west and making its way to the east.”

[As I begin to write this, I really have not found any reasonable way of resolving this problem. If, somehow, there were to be a confusion between the words ‘west’ and ‘east,’ well, that would certainly not seem to agree very well with the phrase “the Christians, perpetrators from the west,” would it? And even if that last phrase could somehow be explained, we would still be left with the fact that the actual comet first became visible “each [morning,] immediately [before] the [rising] of the sun…” That is, in contradistinction to the very opposites of the three bracketed words! That would be a bit much to accept, would it not?

[Nevertheless, allow me to pursue some of these avenues just a little… The Greek word translated “rising” is “δόσιν,” which Greek word seem to be very close to the word “δόσις,” meaning “giving” (Strong’s G1394,) or isn’t that so? But that Greek word could just as well point to the first touch of sunlight upon the morning skies, which would also eliminate our problem with the issue of “before” or “after,” and I too would most certainly have a severe problem with translating the Greek word “μετα” as “before.” But what about the Greek word “ἑσπερας?” Isn’t that always a word meaning “evening” as suggested also per Strong’s G2073? Or else, could it be that Strong’s reference to G5610 “ὥρα” meaning “hour” could provide a clue?Or, how about analyzing the roots of “ἑσπερας” in terms of “ἑσ-” and “περας?” Isn’t it true that “ἑσ-” means “is,” and that “περας” means “pierce, through, across” (G4008,) and that “αφ” means “off, away” (Strong’s G575.) Given also that the word “δυω,” as in “δυτικων,” means “(to sink) to go ‘down,’ ” could it be that the words “εκ τον δυτικων μερον του αφ εσπερας οριζοντος εκαστης” would be better understood in terms of “out of the diminishing [δυτικων] portion of each of the [consequtive] starry night sky [αφ εσπερας] horizons?” That is, could it be that those Greek words represent Phrantzae’s attempt to describe the boundary area between the pitch black starry sky and that portion of the sky where the first light of the dawn is competing with, and dimming, the light of the stars? At the very least, that is where my astronomy software indicates that Halley’s comet was first becoming visible from around September 14, 1453 CE. Furthermore, although Halley’s comet was at that time very very slowly moving towards the western horizon (relative to the fixed stars,) its head was pointing towards the east. It would make sense therefore, for any less experienced observer, to falsely assume that it was moving in the direction in which its head was pointing, that is, from the west towards the east, as per your translations. Accordingly, it seems as though I may have now tentatively found a solution to my above stated problem re your translation:

“a comet… began to appear out of the western parts of the horizon from the beginning of each evening, immediately after the setting of the sun.”

 

 

[Let’s move on then to the next problem I encountered:

“some, seeing the… comet, and its moving from the west and making its way to the east and having approached (to) the moon.”

[I notice that the word translated “west” is “εσπεριων.” But, consistent with the above said, in this context, that word would not necessarily mean “west,” but rather “the black starry sky,” (which was located in the west, yes,) out of which the comet’s head was pointing when it first became visible at the time of the first signs of dawn. Seeing also that the Greek word translated “east” is a word which is primarily attached to any “rising,” that is, not necessarily always pertaining to the east, I find that in this case said ‘rising’ pertains, not only to ‘the east,’ but to the rising of the comet out of the sky where it was not previously seen, and, yes, also to its head pointing towards the eastern horizon [which it was in fact slowly moving away from.] Looking at the word translated “having approached (to,)” that is “πλησιασαντα,” I’ve been unable to locate an exact definition for this word, however, the first portion seem to mean ‘to come near’ and the second portion seem to mean something pertaining to ‘board, bridge, or perfection.’ Accordingly, I see in the word “πλησιασαντα” something on par with that which is inherent in the word ‘eclipse’ and which would well describe an event such as is being displayed by my astronomy software for this encounter on September 25, 1453 CE:

 

 

[In consequence of the above said, I would tend to prefer a translation in terms of “Some, seeing the… comet, and its [appearance of] moving from the west and [of] making its way to the east and having pursued [πορειαν] an encounter with, [ποιουντα] and [having successfully] come into an intimate connection with the moon, and having seen the gloom of the eclipse [that is, the brightness of the moon paling in comparison to the brightness of the embracing comet]...”]

 

8)There is always room for correcting my own conclusions thus far, and before long I hope to be able to give your recent work with Georgii Phrantzae’s text the honor and place it so well deserves… Naturally, any and all comments and feedback from you and others are always more than welcome. I thrive on having my own errors and deficiencies pointed out such that they may be removed or corrected as quickly as is at all possible!

 

Well, as you can see from the above, there is room for further research, by me, by you, and by others, into the basics of this event before we can all agree upon what constitutes a perfectly reliable and correct translation of Georgii Phrantzae’s text, as said text was written and intended by its author, or, at the very least, as that event was originally observed. Nevertheless, thanks to you, and to your translations, I now seem to have found a way of understanding Phrantzae’s Greek text in terms that agrees with that which I am seeing within my astronomy software. I recognize that, in so doing, I could be forcing my own preconceived ideas upon Georgii Phrantzae’s text and, in so doing, do violence to Phrantzae’s intended meaning… However, I also recognize that the same may be said for any conventional translation, most of which translators may not have had the advantage of being able to have any alternative reference to the original event as it actually happened.

 

Indeed, thanks to you I may now consider Georgii Phrantzae’s original Greek text a powerful confirmation of the accuracy of the simulation/reconstruction of the September 25, 1453 CE event as represented by my Starry Night Backyard astronomy software. Conversely I may now consider my Starry Night astronomy software confirmation of the accuracy of Georgii Phrantzae’s original Greek text. This is very valuable to me, and, in time, I believe this will be appreciated likewise by many others!

And, please remember always: Any and all feedback from you is always most welcome and will be much appreciated!

 

Once again, I wish to thank you from the bottom of my heart for helping me with those translations of Georgii Phrantzae’s Greek and Latin texts! I remain very touched when thinking of the love and interest that you have devoted to these translations on my behalf and at my request. Thanks!

 

May the peace of our Creator and Redeemer rest upon each our families and homes,

 

Gunnar ©

 

 

 

 

Från: Taylor, Bernard (LLU) [mailto:btaylor@lluc.org]
Skickat: Tuesday, February 14, 2012 6:03 AM
Till: PowerfulChoices@gmail.com
Ämne: RE: Requesting your assistance in finding a gifted student willing and able to help in translating a brief passage originally written in Greek and translated into Latin...

 

Did you receive the 2 translations??

 

 

 

Finally, you have the translations, Greek and Latin, of the Phrantza original and Latin translation. It has been a fascinating experience. The Greek is clearly Byzantine, which atticizes (models itself on classical forms and approaches), but is neverthless Koine Greek in many respects. Most of the vocabulary can be found in the standard classical lexicon.

On the other hand, the Latin lascks the nuancing and turn of phrase of classical Latin, having long suffered the impact of Vulgar (common) Latin.

As you will see, the text does not say many of things that have been claimed for it, such as the moon or the comet eclipsing the other. While the comet was visible, a regular eclipse occurred, and both texts are verbose in their desire to make this clear.

I trust it is as useful as you have thought it might be. Either way, I now leave it to you to do as you may wish.

I have included a few notes, and the PDF is to ensure that these come through OK. The .docx files are to save your having to retype the translation should the occasion arise. If you cite it, please acknowledge my work.

Kind regards,

Bernard Taylor

 

 

 

יהוה אלהים

Gunnar Anders Smårs Jr © MD

Non-negotiable. Private between the parties.

 

 

 

 

Sweden Republic ©

[Outside the State of Sweden]

 

 

 

Written with a beginning on 5924_[((*??*))] 09[1] 04 2028

 

The Sixth Day, the Preparation Day, 

 

the 4^th day of month #9, 4 Kislev,

in the 5924^th_[(??)] year following the beginning recorded in Genesis 1

and in the 2028^th year following the beginning recorded in Luke 1:26-33

 

[The 3^rd day of the month per ancient Rabbinical reckoning,

4 Tevet (month #10 ) per more recent Jewish reckoning

(based upon a decimal error in Hillel II’s directives causing a wandering of the seasons!),

 

[Friday, the 5^th day of the Pope’s week (as revised in Sweden from 1973 A.D.,)

December 30 in the 2011^th year of Caesar Tiberius

(per current Gregorian reckoning in Europe and elsewhere,)

Cf. Daniel 7:25…]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Requesting your assistance in finding a gifted student willing and able to help

in translating a brief passage

originally written in Greek and translated into Latin…

 

 

 

 

Dear Bernard,

                                                                                            

Within conventional history, Scriptural and Secular alike, I find very many question marks re specific dates. I’ve been doing a lot of research work within the field of Scriptural and Secular Chronology for better than a decade by now. I have found that, in order to even begin the discovery of the correct answers to such questions, it is most certainly of great importance to get our fundamentals straight, be such fundamentals ever so small, and ever so seemingly insignificant at first sight. Indeed, failing such work, many things remain in a state of confusion. The result of such confusion? Well, I believe the word ‘nonsense’ is as good a word as any describing the quality of much of the historical scholarship being built upon such flawed data. Together, we may make a difference in sorting these things out. If you will… That is, if you perceive the inherent value in meeting this need, for I have no funds, in terms of the Kings coins, to pay you! As the apostle once said:

 

Acts 3:6 KJV  Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk.

 

A few months ago I was approached by a Japanese scientist requesting from me a little bit of assistance re the proper meaning of some documents written by the Byzantine historian Georgii Phrantzae who lived and worked in the 15^th century. To be sure, I have been able to provide this Japanese scientist already with part of the answers we are both looking for, but unfortunately I find my basic skills in Greek and Latin being insufficient for completing my job to my full satisfaction.

I am hoping that either you yourself, or else a gifted student of yours, is willing and able to help me translate a brief passage written in Greek, and/or to translate the corresponding brief Latin translation of said Greek passage? Phrantzae’s original text is written in Greek, and there are two Latin translations of that text that have been frequently cited by scholars in the past who apparently were more fluent in Latin than in Greek. It has become obvious to me that those Latin translations are not perfectly correct due to the translators’ all too limited understanding of the astronomy science behind the Greek text. In consequence of this situation, the works of such historians as are relying upon said Latin translations are not what they would otherwise be.

What I need most of all in order to complete my job re the above said is an English translation of about three brief pages out of the original Greek text of Phrantzae. Specifically I am interested in sections ##7-9 on pages 378-380 of the text found at this link (cf. the attached file; Phrantzae’s complete work, Annales, may be downloaded from this link (20MB,) but I perceive no need for you to get into all of that.)

 

I am hoping that perhaps you might be willing to assist me with a basic translation into English of said Greek text of Georgii Phrantzae? There is no need for you to feel intimidated by any concerns re your understanding of the astronomy science behind the text. Those aspects of the Greek will remain for me to wrestle with…

 

Will you help me with a basic English translation of those Greek passages of Georgii Phrantzae, please?

 

 

May the peace of the Creator rest upon each our family and upon each our home,

 

Gunnar Anders Smårs Jr © MD